EXTENDED EPISODE Transcript: Celeste Barclay Samples Highland Love Comes Calling
[00:00:00] Katherine Grant: Welcome to the Historical Romance Sampler Podcast. The place for you to find new historical romance books and authors to fan over. I'm award winning historical romance author Katherine Grant, and each week I'm inviting fellow authors to come on and share a little bit of their work and themselves.
[00:00:21] They'll read a sample of one of their books, and then I'm going to ask them a bunch of questions. By the end of the episode, you'll have a sense of what they write and who they are. Hopefully, you and I both will have something new to read. So what are we waiting for? Let's get into this week's episode.
[00:00:41] All right, well, today I'm joined by Celeste Barclay. Celeste writes strong and faithful heroes and independent and spunky heroines across many eras, including Vikings, Highlanders, Pirates, and Regency. And she also writes contemporary mafia under Sabine Barclay. Celeste was born abroad, raised in the Midwest, summered in England, and now lives in California.
[00:01:07] And she also has degrees in international affairs, secondary social science, and political management, all of which informs her historical romances. I'm super excited to talk to you more today, Celeste.
[00:01:18] Celeste Barclay: Thank you so much. Welcome. Thank you for the invitation. I'm glad to be here too. Any chance to talk histrom is a good chance.
[00:01:26] Katherine Grant: So what are you planning to read for us today? So
[00:01:29] Celeste Barclay: I'm actually going to read an excerpt from a book that is going to launch a brand new series . If you're familiar with me, then you know that I'm writing in one big world that I created.
[00:01:42] Starting with the clan Sinclair and then moving over to the Highland ladies and the Highland ladies always. And then I came back to a second generation for the clan Sinclair legacy. This new series that I'm launching House of Sutherland is also second generation. It's the cousins that, to the clan Sinclair legacy, so we met the parents of these forthcoming heroes and heroines during the Highland Ladies, but this particular book is a prequel.
[00:02:14] So it's set about 50 years before House of Clan Sutherland will take place. But so many people asked me for Hamish and Amelia's stories
[00:02:24] so, it just felt like the right time to give them their own story to launch this series. So this is Hamish and Amelia's story and hamish is at court to deal with a feud and who does he fall for? His enemy's daughter, of course. So needless to say, that did not start things smoothly.
[00:02:47] Nice. Take it away. I'm excited. Awesome. The next sennight passed with a mixture of bliss and torture for Amelia and Hamish. They walked together for the first three days while Kyla and Liam remained at court.
[00:03:00] Just as Kyla suggested, Amelia kept her company while Hamish and Liam spoke because Liam refused to let Kyla out of his sight at Sterling. He was a doting husband who trusted no one with his wife's safety but himself. Between being a former Sutherland and now a Sinclair, along with her beauty, Liam feared the type of attention Kyla would receive if left to navigate court alone.
[00:03:24] She wasn't well versed yet in the duplicity of courtly society. Once those first few days ended, it became harder for Hamish and Amelia to have time together. While the pair had walked with the Sinclair couple, they'd all spoken as equals. The men valued the women's opinions and the women appreciated being listened to.
[00:03:42] After the Sinclairs left, the Queen insisted upon Amelia always walking with the other ladies and waiting. So the first two mornings, Queen Isabella excluded Hamish from the walk altogether.
[00:03:52] But for the last two mornings, he and Amelia happened to meet near the doors before the other women joined them after the morning meal. They led the way outside and into the gardens, which forced the Queen to accept Hamish's company, even if she made it clear he was unwelcome. It was at the end of one of their walks when Hamish noticed the Undercroft in the shade.
[00:04:12] He wondered if he might convince Amelia to steal a few moments alone with him. I must visit the Fletcher before the upcoming hunt, Hamish stated, apropos of nothing, during a rare lull in their conversation. I wonder if he will be busy? If you go soon, you can catch him after the men finish at the targets, but before the midday meal.
[00:04:33] But be brave, he is naaman keen to miss any meals. I've seen him. I know what you mean. Hamish wracked his mind for a reason for her to go with him, or to meet him in the Undercroft afterward. It wouldn't matter if he didn't go to the Fletcher at all. Would you care to see the falconry? I ken it's near the Fletcher.
[00:04:54] Amelia looked in the direction in which the arrow maker and the hunting birds lay. She realized their route would take them past the Undercroft with its cool and dim spaces no one would visit during late morning. She glanced up at Hamish. Aye, I would. Can you walk there with me, or would you have to meet me?
[00:05:12] Hamish ensured his words wouldn't carry on the light breeze that lifted the hair from Amelia's shoulders in a tantalizing wave. I can meet you there. I cannot tarry for too long, but I will find an excuse. Amelia answered as they and the rest of the Queen's entourage reached the end of the gardens. She whispered, Give me five minutes.
[00:05:31] Hamish turned to face her and offered her his hand, as had become their routine at the end of their walks. Amelia rested her palm in his before he brought the back to his lips. He brushed his against the smooth skin as his thumb stroked hers, but it only lasted a couple heartbeats before he let her go.
[00:05:50] He bowed as the Queen passed them, and Amelia fell into line with the fellow ladies. He watched them go into the keep before he hurried to the Fletcher. He would use the few minutes he had to check on the order of new arrows he'd placed. He would attach his own feathers to the end, being very particular about them.
[00:06:09] But he knew the man's expert craftsmanship for the wood projectiles. He paid and gathered his quiver before slipping into the undercroft. He stood beneath an archway, out of sight, but where he could spy Amelia. Lia, Hamish whispered. She was looking for him when she appeared to stroll by. But he already knew her well enough to tell it was her purposeful walk that was meant to fool people, into thinking she merely glided from one place to another.
[00:06:37] He'd strolled with her many times in the garden, and along the riverbank where they went riding. He could tell the difference. She glanced around before joining him. They retreated into the shadows. This way, Amelia murmured. She took his hand without a second thought and led them into the area near the buttery.
[00:06:54] She scanned their surroundings until they reached a door to a storeroom she believed was empty. Wait, Hamish breathed. He shifted and pressed her to his far side. He eased the door open and peeked inside. The outside light was so dim, it did little to illuminate the storage area, but he was certain there was no one inside.
[00:07:13] When they stepped in and he shut the door, it pitched them into darkness. A sole window near the ceiling did little to circulate the stifling air or allow light into the room with stacks of grain. But neither cared. They came together in a needy kiss that had no finesse, but all their unsatisfied longing for one another.
[00:07:31] Their hands roamed over the other's body, savoring each inch they discovered. Hamish dropped his quiver to the ground. He kept his sporran between them, worried his turgid length would frighten her. If only he'd known how much she longed to discover what lay behind it. But Amelia was too timid to suggest anything or move it herself.
[00:07:50] She feared what he would think of her brazenness, even if he seemed to enjoy her eagerness. Soon mere kisses weren't enough. Hamish lifted her and she wrapped her legs around him, grateful her full skirts allowed her the room to do that. He'd spied a table while the light was behind him. He could see its vague outline as he moved toward it, careful not to bump into it when he got close.
[00:08:13] He placed Amelia on the flat surface as they continued to kiss. He moved without haste as he drew her skirts up to her ankles. When she didn't protest, he bared her calves and slipped his hands around the muscled flesh. Amelia's legs wrapped around Hamish's as his hands ran up her thighs. When he grasped them, she tried to pull herself closer.
[00:08:33] She clutched his lenya and arched her back. She cupped his neck and then his jaw. She ran her fingers through his hair and down his back. His palms inched up her thighs until he reached her hips. He pulled her to the edge of the table, but the sporran finally irritated them both too much. He pushed it around his waist, allowing his sword to press against her teeth.
[00:08:53] It was the first time she'd felt a man's arousal pressed to her mound. Amelia's moan was nearly his undoing. Do you ken what it means? Hamish was unaware of how much Amelia knew about how couples came together. I ken what it means, Amelia assured him. As though speaking to one another silently, Amelia leaned back at the same time Hamish leaned forward until her shoulders brushed the tabletop.
[00:09:18] He lifted her hips so he could notch his rod at her entrance. If they had no clothes between them, he would have thrust and entered her. Claimed her. Instead, they moved together just as they would one day when they could finally join as one. His fingers bit into her flesh until he worried he would leave marks.
[00:09:35] When he eased his hold, Amelia's hands flew to his through the clothing that separated them, pressing his fingertips deeper. I'll leave marks your maid will recognize, Hamish whispered. She prepares my bath, but she does not help me with it. It wouldn't have caused suspicion if she only saw me in my shimmies for a few days.
[00:09:53] I would ken they're there though. I would see them. Amelia felt his breath beside her ear when he whispered. Now it tickled her neck as he kissed along it, tightening his grip as he did. She let go of her hesitation and gathered his plaid over his backside. She sat up as best she could while he continued to kiss her neck and shoulder.
[00:10:13] Her hands grasped his chiseled behind. She'd felt nothing like it. When she squeezed, she felt his rod jerk. She didn't know why he groaned, then froze. She feared she'd done something wrong, but he was soon moving against her as he had before. It ignited need unlike anything she'd felt before.
[00:10:31] She ached, but she didn't know what to do to ease it. She didn't know what to ask for or what to tell Hamish to do. In turn, Hamish appreciated the darkness since Amelia couldn't see how his cheeks heated. The moment she'd grabbed his backside and pressed him tighter against his mound, he'd lost control and spent himself.
[00:10:48] He feared she would know why his cock jerked between them, but she made no sign that she understood what had just happened, that he hadn't shocked her. And that she hadn't recoiled in horror or amusement made him even hungrier for more of her. While he might have found his release, he was unconvinced he should take their interlude far enough for him to bring her to climax.
[00:11:10] He wanted to offer the relief and pleasure he'd found, but he didn't want to ruin the moment by doing something she didn't want or that might scare her. They continued to move together, kissing and touching, until voices floated to them outside the storeroom. They froze, both looking toward the door.
[00:11:26] Whomever was outside passed close enough for them to hear footsteps. It was a bucket of frigid water. It reminded them of all they risked if they were found together. It would force them to marry, but not with the respect they believed their partner deserved. Neither worried for their own reputation, but that of the person they were growing to love.
[00:11:44] Hamish stepped back, his ardor cooled from the interruption, and his no longer aching bollocks. He helped Amelia arrange her skirts, then eased her to her feet. They wrapped their arms around one another, neither ready to leave their little hideaway. After the lust came a moment of loving affection.
[00:12:02] The last kiss they shared was little more than a peck before Hamish gathered his quiver, and they slipped out of the room to go in opposite directions. With the king's permission to court, neither the queen nor the mistress of the bedchamber, who oversaw the ladies in waiting, could deny Amelia time with Hamish in the afternoons.
[00:12:19] He went to the list after his walk with Amelia, refreshed himself before the midday meal, and went riding with her after they'd eaten. They took a contingency of Ross and Sutherland guards. But Roy insisted Henrietta accompany them as a chaperone. She unsurprisingly proved to be a constant irritation to both Hamish and Amelia.
[00:12:38] She inserted herself into every conversation and often forced herself between them when they rode or walked. When Amelia wasn't looking, but guards were, she'd smile coyly at Hamish and even winked. He attempted to pay her no attention, which was a challenge, since she liked to brush against him any chance she had.
[00:12:56] Amelia noticed everything Henrietta did, and it infuriated her more than hurt her. She expected her cousin to disregard her feelings and everything she always had since they were children. But her flagrant attempts to seduce Hamish were beyond the pale. Amelia didn't fail. Amelia didn't fear Hamish's intentions during.
[00:13:15] It was the inconvenience of Henrietta always being present that led Amelia to thoughts of violence. She appreciated Hamish's tact when he maneuvered around Henrietta figuratively and literally and always came to her side. Henrietta was a skilled rider, but she hadn't spent as many hours in the saddle as Hamish, nor did she have the natural balance and strength Amelia possessed.
[00:13:38] Once Hamish realized this, he urged Amelia to race with him. They'd charge ahead, leaving Henrietta behind with two Ross guards. It was those times when Amelia felt freest, and that Hamish believed her the loveliest. Her laughter and twinkling eyes beguiled him. Will you join the hunt this evening? Hamish wondered as they stood together beside a stream midway through the third week of their courtship.
[00:14:02] They'd sneaked away to the storeroom almost every day since their first interlude, but they never carried things further than they had the first time. Both wanted far more, but neither felt comfortable admitting it. Hamish didn't want to frighten Amelia with the force of his ardor, and consequently, Amelia feared being far too forceful if she asked for, or did more.
[00:14:22] They were quietly driving each other mad with unspent lust. But it was more than that. Each day spent in each other's company, and each touch and kiss became a way to show how deep their feelings grew. They spent as many hours together as they could, but it never felt enough. The horses guzzled the chilly water as the couple held hands.
[00:14:42] They knew Henrietta wouldn't join them for at least ten minutes given her staid pace. I didn't ken if I can. I'd like to. Amelia's wistful expression made Hamish committed to ensuring she rode out with him and the other hunters. He drew her in for a kiss as his free hand rested low on her back. His ring finger and little finger brushed against her bottom.
[00:15:02] He turned them so Amelia's back was to the stream. He risked her rejection and others spying them because they were in the open. But he slid his hand down to cup her behind. She leaned into him, pressing her breasts to his chest. Lust pushed the kiss to new heights each time they came together. He squeezed her backside as he released her hand.
[00:15:22] He skimmed up her ribs until it slipped between them to cup her breast. When she grew bolder with her kiss, he groaned. The sound surprised him since he hadn't intended to make one. After their first rendezvous in the storeroom and hearing people walk past, they were always careful to remain quiet. But he longed for her and he didn't mind letting her know the effect she had on him.
[00:15:43] She fisted his lenya, holding him close, lest he step back before she was ready to end the interlude. When they were breathless, their lips pulled away, but their bodies remained pressed together. Lia, I ken we're in public, so I willna do more, but lass the way you tempt me. He grinned and shook his head.
[00:16:01] Each kiss they shared, tucked away in the undercroft or along the stream, when they stopped to water their horses, grew more passionate by the day. But it wasn't solely lust, it was far deeper than that. And you didn't think you'd tempt me? She'd never believed the notion women couldn't and shouldn't enjoy physical relations with men.
[00:16:19] She hadn't held out hope she would ever enjoy it, but Hamish's kisses promised more than she'd dreamed of when she'd considered marriage in the past. I hope I tempt you, I hope I tempt you to want me in all the ways I want you. They hadn't spoken of their emotions toward one another, but Hamish could wait no longer to know if Amelia felt what he did.
[00:16:40] It worried him that she was inexperienced, so curiosity drove her. It worried him that she enjoyed his company, but wasn't in falling in love the way he was. In turn, Amelia secretly shared the same fears. Do you Ken I'm attracted to you? Didn't my kisses tell you that? They do, but is it just? Is that all?
[00:17:03] Hamish stumbled then blurted his thoughts. Her hesitation was soul crushing. Do you feel more? Hamish realized she feared he wanted her to admit her feelings then wouldn't reciprocate. She feared being made a fool. A lot more, Lia. So much more. Nay one has ever made me feel important before. You ask how I'm doing and truly listen.
[00:17:24] It isn't done as a courtesy before speaking about yourself. You ask me about it, thing, you ask, you ask me about things we've spoken about before. Nay, because you were not listening and cannot remember. Just the opposite. You listen and you make me feel you care about what I say. I didn't think most women at court ever have this.
[00:17:45] What you say interests me, Hamish told her, but even when we aren't talking, I enjoy your company. It brings me peace to stand here at the stream with you and just look toward the highlands. I enjoy seeing the excitement in your eyes when we race. Your patience with the banshee impresses me when I would like to do not more than throttle her.
[00:18:05] Hamish glanced over his shoulder, knowing Henrietta and the other guards would soon catch up. I am nay patient. I just I cannot kill her and have anyone notice. Amelia only partly jested. Her cousin had been particularly hideous that morning during the meal and their walk. She'd spoken to the other ladies, hinting Hamish used Amelia as an excuse to spend time with her instead of the other way around.
[00:18:28] She alluded to him preferring her over Amelia. She didn't think anyone believed Henrietta, but she didn't appreciate anyone listening in case it gave credence to the rumors Henrietta attempted to spread. She will not come on the hunt, will she? Amelia laughed derisively. Nay. It's one thing she cannot be the center of attention at.
[00:18:48] She kens the men will not take any notice of her when they can prove their manhood while taunting one another. Good. They stepped apart as they heard the approaching hoofbeats, but Hamish refused to let Amelia be out of his reach any time they stopped during the rides. He held her hand and turned so the two of them faced downstream.
[00:19:07] Henrietta had to be their chaperone, but she didn't have to be part of their conversation. He figured if they got a head start as she climbed down from her saddle, pride would keep her from chasing after them. Hamish! Henrietta called out. He pretended not to hear. Hamish! She veritably squawked his name.
[00:19:25] With a sigh and a glance down at Amelia, they turned around. Aye? Can you check my saddle? Something doesn't feel, doesn't it feel right. Hamish shot a glance to one of his warriors. Guilt tugged at him, but he proceeded anyway. Gareth was a stable lad before he started training in the list. He kens far more than I do about tack and horses.
[00:19:47] It wasn't entirely true. The man was five years older than Hamish, so he started working before Hamish could. The extra time with horses was the only thing that justified the claim he knew more. Hamish had been tending his steed since he was ten summers. There was little he didn't know about animals.
[00:20:05] Hamish had already turned away. Amelia followed. His stride was long, so his pace wasn't faster than usual, but it forced Amelia to take two steps to his every one. She knew she looked as though she sprinted to keep up, but they were soon in a copse of trees that hid them from the others. Their kiss was hungry as they devoured one another again, admitting their feelings, then being interrupted left them even more unsatisfied than their brief daily trysts.
[00:20:31] Both of his hands cupped her backside after she pushed his sporran out of the way. She tilted her hips forward, wanting to rub herself against him. When he held her tight and rocked his hips, she thought she would lose her mind with need. She could think of nothing more than how she wanted more. Lia, it's just as well we aren't alone, otherwise I would ravish ya.
[00:20:51] Mayhap it's the fresh air or being able to see you in the bright light, but I want you more than I ever have, and I didn't ken how that's possible. Is it ravishing if I want it just as much? Would you ravish me then? Och aye, my duel. I cannot hear you call me that enough, my ghoul. They both froze for a moment, gazes locked, before Hamish cupped her cheeks.
[00:21:15] I let that slip, but you are my love. I can't, it hasn't been nearly long enough for most people to believe. I feel it is more than infatuation, but I can, what I can. This isn't fleeting. Amelia lifted her chin and offered him a soft kiss before responding. You are more here. You are a Melchior because you have my heart.
[00:21:35] I would call you my heart in Gaelic or Scots, French or English, any language speaks the truth. This isn't a fleeting for me either, Hamish. You and I both ken, the moon is for everyone else to accept us. Even if we ken each other
[00:21:48] years, there would still be things to discover about each other once we married. Either way, we will have to learn to live with each other, but how I feel will not change. Your wisdom is likely what I love most about you. He squeezed her backside with both hands, but I'm fond of the rest of you too.
[00:22:08] Katherine Grant: Ooh, that was both spicy and sweet.
[00:22:11] Celeste Barclay: Oh, yes. So in my historicals all of the stories have progressing scenes of heat, but there's no sex before marriage. It may be a hand fast. It might be marriage by consent.
[00:22:24] It might be a ceremony at the Kirk, but that is where, you know, the heat boundary is before marriage, there's a whole lot that leads up to it, but after marriage, there's consummation and, and more.
[00:22:39] Katherine Grant: Ooh, I want to pick up on that. First we're going to take a quick break for our sponsors.
[00:22:44] Hey samplers! It's Katherine Grant. I am interrupting this episode to tell you how to get a free book, the Viscount Without Virtue. First, go to bit.ly/hrs fan, go through the checkout process. This is where you add the promo code, HR SFAN as your last step. Just download your free ebook to your ereader.
[00:23:11] Alright, well let's get back to this week's episode.
[00:23:13] And
[00:23:14] we are back with Celeste Barclay, who just read an excerpt. I didn't write it down. What's the title of that book?
[00:23:20] Celeste Barclay: Highland Love Comes Calling.
[00:23:22] Katherine Grant: Highland Love Comes Calling, which is part of the Clan Sutherland series that you're launching this year.
[00:23:28] Celeste Barclay: Yes. And I will admit I had the opportunity to do a photo shoot with Michael Foster, who's that really tall, funky hero that you see on a lot of covers, both, you know, Regency esque and medieval.
[00:23:44] I was at the Historical Romance Retreat, and I did the photo shoot, and there were two shots that I liked enough. I put myself on two of my covers. I am narcissistic enough to do that, and I That's awesome! Oh my gosh, I love that. Thank you. So I am the face on the and the body. I wasn't photoshopped in.
[00:24:03] That is truly me. On the cover of Highland Love Comes Calling, and on Highland Strength, which is the second to last book in the Clan Sinclair legacy.
[00:24:13] Katherine Grant: Amazing. I'm going to go look at that cover as soon as this is over. Okay. So you had just mentioned that in your historicals, you have a boundary in terms of steam where there's no full penetrative sex until after some sort of marriage ceremony.
[00:24:32] And that actually ties in with the question that I had, as you were reading, thinking about, and this is something that we all have to think about as historical romance authors, so I'm curious about your take on, for the modern reader, having modern sex positivity, and then entering the world of historical romance where our characters would have different sensibilities.
[00:24:53] How do you think about that?
[00:24:56] Celeste Barclay: So, I made a conscious choice when I started writing that this was the way I wanted to do it. That I would have plenty of You know, explicitness in the scenes leading up to it, and that they would kind of grow in heat as they progressed, and that, you know, The marriage would have more than just the vows exchanged, that finally having penetrative sex was truly the consummation of their feelings and of that commitment that they made because there's no going back after that.
[00:25:32] Whether she's a virgin or not, there's no going back after that. And I do have in a harlot at the Highland court. A woman who made not a great choice and wound up pregnant and the hero comes in and saves the day. So it's not like every single one of my books has a virgin heroine. An angel at the Highland court.
[00:25:53] She was hand fasted before she met the man she fell in love with. But it's for me, it's more of that moment is that culmination, like I said, of everything that has led up to it, and so it's as much an emotional bonding moment as it is a physical one, and so that is kind of also the point where we've been leading into us versus them, but once they're married, it truly is us against the world, and I think that I have angst in my stories, but it's not angst between them.
[00:26:29] For me, as an author, I don't need to get through two thirds of the book before the couple is together. For me, if you're going to be together, you should have figured that out within two thirds of a book, especially when you write long books like I do. You know, if you write 150 to 200 page books, and that's what you read, then that's different.
[00:26:50] But when you write 300 page books, two thirds is 200 pages of like, are you or aren't you? Like, haven't you not figured this out already? And so I'm very much in us against the world kind of feel when it comes to the, the the couples. But as far as, you know, the, the modernity of how we write. Just to draw a comparison, I write Kinky Mafia as Sabine Barclay, and marriage is not a consideration.
[00:27:21] You do you, boo! And they do a whole lot. So I think that, for me as an author, that is not like a moral line for me. That's not why I drew it where I did. But moving forward I think that as a genre, we are going to have to be more flexible in that. And it's not that you necessarily have to be more explicit in your storytelling, but just recognize the truth.
[00:27:48] There have been illegitimate children since nearly the dawn of time . Born on the wrong side of the blanket kind of deal. It's not something that necessarily, you know, for a few centuries, was socially acceptable to talk about, but there are cultures where being a bastard was not the end of the world and that, you know, promiscuity was not the end of the world, that having sex before marriage was not the end of the world.
[00:28:17] We have the Victorians to thank for kind of whitewashing all of that. So, You know, even when we get to the point where we kind of catch up with those modern senses, it's not historically inaccurate to do that, you know, just because we have a particular notion right now of what histrom is doesn't mean that that's the way it should stay and I think you know in order to continue our readership, we're going to have to acknowledge that reader expectations are different and that's not a bad thing, but it is a reflection still of what truly happened.
[00:28:56] Illegitimacy is not a newfound concept and I think we will all survive.
[00:29:03] Katherine Grant: I agree. Well, and I think it ties in a lot of your, like, as you were describing the castle and the Undercroft and even their clothes, you clearly know all of the historical details. Sometimes I think the instinct to say, oh, no, it wasn't that way is an instinct to protect like the stakes of why these people aren't having sex or adding intrigue because of that. But there are actually historical details we can use that there are stakes, but it was still happening.
[00:29:32] Celeste Barclay: Oh, yeah. I mean, you know, it does not take a degree in sociology or anthropology or biology to understand how humans come together. And part of why we love reading and writing romance is that push and pull, that dynamic, that discovery of emotions and how they are unique to that one other person.
[00:29:59] And there is a physical manifestation of that. Whether you indulge it or repress it or however you want to look at it. There is a physiological reaction to attraction. So for me and the way I write, I see no harm in expressing that.
[00:30:20] We all have our thresholds of interest and comfort. But for me, I don't think writing explicit scenes diminishes from all the other action that goes on in my stories, you know, I would say that I do write. romantic suspense. Like, there's a lot of, where are we going? Who's the bad guy? What's going to happen next?
[00:30:43] Why did that happen? You know, that, that question of, can I figure out truly who the villain is for the reader to have as, as they're progressing through the story. So yeah, there are explicit scenes and there's quite a few of them. But when you write, 300 to 400 page books, there's also a whole lot going on in between, even if I had 10 or 15 sex scenes.
[00:31:06] There's still a whole lot going on.
[00:31:09] Katherine Grant: Okay, so as you were setting up the story, you were saying that this is part of a big world, you write in one big world.
[00:31:14] So I'm very intrigued by that. How do you keep track of your world building?
[00:31:20] Celeste Barclay: Let me preface this by saying that I did not go into writing with a plan. I did it with no forethought, which is extremely atypical of me. I like to have an idea of where things are going and why I'm doing them, but I had an idea for His Highland Lass and I decided on a whim to write the story.
[00:31:43] And so I had, you know, kind of some thoughts about a series of this young woman who's the youngest of five kids and that, you know, her four older brothers would have their stories too. And then I did a prequel for their parents which is where you initially meet Hamish. And from there, it just kind of kept going.
[00:32:05] So when I finished that series, I actually went to write a Viking series.
[00:32:10] So, as I worked through my series, you know, I wanted this big world. So the, the Vikings kind of went to the side for a little bit. And the Highland Ladies was the direct spin off of the Clan Sinclair, the, the heroine in the first book A Spinster at the Highland Court, makes appearances in the last two books about the brothers in the Clan Sinclair, and so it just kind of went from there.
[00:32:41] And then, you know, I had in the Clan Sinclair, I'd said that Kyla was a Sutherland and that she was Hamish's younger sister. So in the Clan Sinclair, in the Highland Ladies, I took Hamish's children, two daughters and a son. And they got their own books. And so it just kept building and building. And then when I finished that, I went to the Clan Sinclair Legacy.
[00:33:05] And in the very first book, Highland Lion, I tie it back to the Viking series. So the two main characters, the hero and the heroine, are each descendants of characters from that series that were already closely blended as, as family and friends. So I, I looped it back together and then now, you know, House of Clans Sutherland is another second generation that is an offshoot and runs parallel in timeline to the Clan Sinclair legacy.
[00:33:38] So truly I kept it all in the family and, you know, there's so many clans in Scotland during that time, but it's not that difficult to pair people off. And as you know, the clan Sinclair legacy showed and I paired up, you know, a couple of characters that were the offspring of the clan Sinclair and the Highland ladies.
[00:34:02] I'm going to continue to do that because readers said. What's going to happen to these couples now that you're done with these stories? And I said, Oh, don't you worry. I got lots more stories to tell. So the couples from the Highland Ladies and the Highland Ladies always, well, their children will start to blend in with the Sutherland grandkids and the Clan Sinclair grandkids.
[00:34:24] So yeah, it's one big world. And it's easy for me to do because I've set it in a specific region of the highlands. I've picked a time that is super rich in adversity and conflict. There's lots and lots of historical fodder for conflicts between the clans. And so it just, it makes it easy for me to build that world because there's so much historical stuff.
[00:34:53] that I can use to, to wrap into it.
[00:34:56] Katherine Grant: Yeah. And so how do you incorporate the research part into the creative writing part? Do you do the research first and then write, or is it kind of throughout the process>
[00:35:06] Celeste Barclay: so my mother is English and I spent a lot of time in England as a child and read a lot of history books about England.
[00:35:15] And as we know history is written by the victors. So when I started reading or started writing Scottish Highlanders, I had to reframe my knowledge to a different perspective and take the opposite side. And now I'm like, those dastardly Englishmen, they have our land, you know, can't take away my freedom.
[00:35:38] So. There I came to it with a lot of knowledge. Plus I had been an advanced placement European history teacher, which, if you're not American, is a secondary school course that is taught at a college level. So I brought in a lot of knowledge already. And then when I pick which two clans I want to pair up, I research, you know, who were their allies, who were their enemies, what things were going on, you know, within 200 years, if I'm really pushing it, of those dates, usually within maybe 100 at most, that I can use as catalysts.
[00:36:20] And so I do research as need be but you know, I am not writing textbooks anymore. So I'm not looking to regurgitate every fact I find. I take it as a holistic approach and figure out what I can weave in. And some of it never gets explicitly stated, but it has enhanced my understanding in order to, to bring that bigger picture into the story.
[00:36:50] Yeah. And I'm fortunate. I have the memory of a steel trap, you know, memory of an elephant, at least for the things that matter to me. So I can recall a lot of the history. Can't always recall the eye color of characters from like 20 books ago. Yeah. I remember a lot of the historical facts.
[00:37:10] Katherine Grant: Yeah. So I was going to ask nitty-gritty wise, especially with the world building, do you have a series bible where you keep track of the characters and their characteristics and all that?
[00:37:18] Celeste Barclay: I do. So I use a program called Plotter, and I am not a plotter when it comes to fiction. I don't plan out very closely what's going to happen. I am a, a pantser or a plotty pantser. What is it? A discovery author. There's any number of names for us, but basically we'll see where the story takes me. So, you know, I do have to keep track of that.
[00:37:50] Between my historical and my contemporary, I've written 55 and a quarter books at this point. Like, I have, you know, that's over a hundred main characters, never mind all the secondary. So I do have to, to take notes to keep track. So I use this program Plotter as my story Bible. So rather than as its name tells you, I don't use it for plotting, but it has features that are really great for me to keep track of everything.
[00:38:20] And then I wrote the Highland Ladies guide, which goes as a reader guide to the Highland Ladies and the Highland Ladies Always. And so that gives readers insights into the different characters and the setting and the history and things like that, because it is a long, it was. 15 books originally, and I split it in half, so the Highland Ladies was 15, now it's the Highland Ladies is 8, and the Highland Ladies Always is 7, but that companion guide helps, because there's a lot of people to keep track of, there's a lot of history to keep track of, there's a lot of locations to keep track of.
[00:38:58] And it helped me as well, so I wrote this companion book for other people, but it became my, my well documented series Bible. So it was a blessing in disguise to do that. That's cool. I do have an excellent memory, but I had over 300 characters at this point. No, yeah. I can't remember all of them. Yeah.
[00:39:20] Katherine Grant: And so you said you've written 55 books. Would you say, have you, how do you think your writing has transformed, grown, or changed since your first book?
[00:39:31] Celeste Barclay: It definitely has. I think the fluidity and cadence of my writing has improved a little bit. You know, with that first book, because I didn't have a plan, and I didn't know where I was going with this, I wasn't really sure how much to put into it.
[00:39:49] I wasn't sure if I should go further in some parts and less in others. I didn't have my feet under me, despite the hundreds of historical romance books I had already read. It's different when you're writing them yourself. So I've just kind of grown into that and I feel more comfortable where to develop the story arc and things along those lines.
[00:40:14] I think the complexity of the storylines has grown as I became more comfortable with the storytelling. But at the heart of it, no matter what book you read, whether it's His Highland Lasts, my very first book, or, you know, one of my Mafia ones, or Highland Love Comes Calling, you will always find the same core themes.
[00:40:36] It will always be family is the hub. Whether it's by blood or by choice, and then loyalty, honor, duty and love are the ones that are the spokes off of that. So that has never ever changed. That will always, because that's just intuitively what I value, that will always be the same. That will never change unless, you know, I write something monumentally different.
[00:41:00] Katherine Grant: It's really interesting to think about how inevitably we change because we're people who are growing, but then there are also these themes that are just going to continue to show up because We're interested in them. We value them. We're obsessed with them.
[00:41:15] Celeste Barclay: Those were themes that I didn't intentionally start out with. It took a little reflection to realize, oh, these keep coming up over and over again. This must be, you know, what I value in my storytelling. They're things that are really important to me in real life. So it shouldn't be shocking that they play out in my stories, but I did not go into writing with those as, you know things that I intended to work into it.
[00:41:43] It was more of a, a revelation, if you will.
[00:41:46] Katherine Grant: Yeah. The writing tells on us. All right. Well, we are going to do our fun segment.
[00:41:53] Are you a romantic?
[00:41:58] Which do you trust more your heart, your gut, or your brain?
[00:42:01] Celeste Barclay: Well, you know, you can break a circle into thirds and still make a complete circle.
[00:42:05] So all depends on the situation as to which is talking louder, but I don't discredit any of them.
[00:42:14] Katherine Grant: Do you believe in love at first sight?
[00:42:16] Celeste Barclay: I do. I think that often it's lust at first sight, but I do believe that in some people's case, it just clicks. And, you know, love at first sight slash love at first conversation.
[00:42:30] I do think it's possible. Do you believe in soulmates? I do. I don't think that everybody meets their soulmates. I think that some people meet a partner that is the perfect partner for them. They're highly compatible, but it doesn't necessarily mean they're soulmates. And I think that soulmates goes beyond just romantic relationships.
[00:42:51] I think that you can have soulmates in a platonic relationship as well. Just somebody who is your perfect match that is, you know, the other half of, of who you are. So I do think it's absolutely possible. Do you believe in true love? I do. I don't necessarily believe that true love lasts a lifetime. For some folks, it doesn't.
[00:43:15] You know, some folks, It crumbles, you know, for other people, you see those couples that are in their 80s that have been married for 60 years and they're still affectionate with each other, you know, they're not just trying not to kill each other kind of deal. So I do think it will, it exists, but I also think that it's something.
[00:43:35] That you nurture because life is hard. There's a lot of stuff out there and marriage or a committed relationship is not easy. So for longevity, it takes work, but I, I do believe that there is such thing as true love. Just sometimes it's not lasting.
[00:43:52] Katherine Grant: Okay. And final question. Why is romantic love important?
[00:43:55] Celeste Barclay: Well, I think it completes us as a species. That yes, we do have folks for whom it's not applicable but for the vast majority of us, it is in some form or another. I don't think that it only resides in one way, but if we're, you know, for the perpetuation of the species. It exists. But I think also just the way that, that we are, are programmed that we look for that companionship that is different than, than relationships that we have that are platonic that, that, that feeds a part of us that exists and why that exists.
[00:44:39] So I think it is just a part of us that also keeps us in balance. It, it offers us fulfillment that we don't get elsewhere. It can offer us a shelter from the storm and an opportunity to be a way that you can't be with other people or, you know, the rest of the world.
[00:45:01] It's just one of many parts of our life as human beings. But I think it is for many people, not everybody, but many people, what helps complete them along with all those others. You know, it's a jigsaw puzzle.
[00:45:16] Katherine Grant: Yeah, I like that answer. So I am going to declare you a romantic romantic.
[00:45:25] Celeste Barclay: I am. I mean, not for nothing. I've been married 20 years. So, and I haven't killed him and he hasn't killed me.
[00:45:31] Katherine Grant: All right. Well, before we say goodbye, where can readers find You?
[00:45:35] Celeste Barclay: You can find most of my books in Kindle Unlimited. They are available for purchase on Amazon. The Viking Glory series is available across retailers.
[00:45:47] It's wide. I have a number of audiobooks that are also wide, so you could get them places like Spotify, audiobooks. com, Audible, Scribd. I'm all over the place. Google me or go to my website and you will find me. Or if you are an Amazon loyal shopper, just go there. I'm there.
[00:46:06] Katherine Grant: Awesome. We'll put links in the show notes too.
[00:46:08] So be sure to check those out. Well, thank you so much Celeste. I've really appreciated this. I feel like we could keep talking for another three hours.
[00:46:16] Celeste Barclay: Thank you.
[00:46:16] Katherine Grant: That's it for this week. Check out the show notes where I put links for my guests, myself, and the podcast. Until next week, happy reading.